Chinese In North America(北美华人e网)

注册
返回列表 «89101112131415 / 15
发新话题 回复该主题

[信息共享]

101#


层主解释的很有道理。楼主第一篇讲的倒算法其实我就不是很理解了。因为我一个同事用楼主的办法算过了,17年州税退税完全不应该算作应纳税收入。但是不符合层主说的任何情况。所以我现在又糊涂了。哇哇哇

ashrimp 发表于 4/14/2019 2:46:39 PM 提醒一下大部分人都可能省税的今年才有的特殊情况-101楼

作为一个完全没有税务知识的理工男, 贴主其实是不满于这个不求甚解法的, 那我又能怎样呢? 难道去看那个176 页的 IRS 525 不成?  吃饱了撑的嘛
--------强迫症分割线-------
IRS 525, Section Recoveries

Example 34.

In 2017, Jean Black filed as head of household and itemized her deductions on Schedule A (Form 1040). Her taxable income was $5,260 and her tax was $528. She claimed a child care credit of $1,200. The credit reduced her tax to zero and she had an unused tax credit of $672 ($1,200 − $528). In 2018, Jean recovered $1,000 of her itemized deductions. She reduces her 2017 itemized deductions by $1,000 and refigures that year's tax on taxable income of $6,260. However, the child care credit exceeds the refigured tax of $628. Jean's tax liability for 2017 isn't changed by reducing her deductions by the recovery. She didn't have a tax benefit from the recovered deduction and doesn't include any of the recovery in her income for 2018.


Subject to AMT.

If you were subject to the AMT in the year of the deduction, you'll have to refigure your tax for the earlier year to determine if the recovery must be included in your income. This will require a refiguring of your regular tax, as shown in Example 34 , and a refiguring of your AMT. If inclusion of the recovery doesn't change your total tax, you don't include the recovery in your income. However, if your total tax increases by any amount, you received a tax benefit from the deduction and you must include the recovery in your income up to the amount of the deduction that reduced your tax in the earlier year.



  以上让我重温GRE的魔幻时刻。。。  原来速成法其实就是正统法,  algorithm:
0.  you were subject to the AMT in the year of the deduction
    Yes
  1. you'll have to refigure your tax for the earlier year to determine if the recovery must be included in your income
      我理解这里的recovery  比如是我们想问州退税 should include or not, 比如3,000


2.  This will require a refiguring of your regular tax, as shown in Example 34 , and a refiguring of your AMT.
       Example 34 什么鬼!?  主要它提到的credit 等等scenario 爆了这么多年税从来没沾过光


3.  If inclusion of the recovery doesn't change your total tax, you don't include the recovery in your income.
      inclusion of the recovery:  把 state refund 重新加回去? 所以去改state withholding 是最好理解的, 就像例子She reduces her 2017 itemized deductions by $1,000 and refigures that year's tax on taxable income of $6,260. 【5260 + 1000】
    所以贴主 加了3000 回去, 发现 还是 85,710


4.  However, if your total tax increases by any amount, you received a tax benefit from the deduction and you must include the recovery in your income up to the amount of the deduction that reduced your tax in the earlier year.    请试着一口气读下来
    however, 如果加进 state  withholding 2000快  line 47 变了一块, 那么 you must include 3000- 2000 =1000    


以上, 贴主尽力了, 吃饭去











avo 发表于 4/14/2019 3:27:44 PM
这个example34的意思是因为$1000的itemlized deduction被recovery了,TI增加了$1000。但是由于child care credit是nonrefundable的,这个人最后还是不用交税,所以就不需要加回去了。

---发自Huaren 官方 iOS APP

最后编辑cheesecakefun 最后编辑于 2019-04-15 02:20:01
TOP
agree
0
disagree
0
102#

[quote]

我今天就是用Turbo Tax 2018 改的。 如果你的情况符合条件,当你输入(或者edit)2017 state tax return的时候,就会让你选是全计入taxable income,还是重新计算。选重新计算,然后follow instruction 就好了。 需要turbo tax 2017, 然后就几步,不麻烦的。






感谢楼主分享但对于报税小白来说这个mm说的更明白,如果你不确定是不是符合条件,就按这个楼说的方法选重新计算然后把17年的数字一摸一样的填到18年,没变就是不符合条件,找回来就是楼主说的吧,我家找回来1000多赶脚赚了一个亿。专业人士看看这样是不是有问题?
嘉菲猫 发表于 4/14/2019 3:13:58 PM
Turbo tax并不能帮助你看你符不符合条件,你要自己判断。软件只是帮助你简便计算的过程而已。

---发自Huaren 官方 iOS APP

TOP
agree
0
disagree
0
103#

我前两个星期仔细研究了下, 以为懂了。 结果看完这个又不懂了。

大家讨论下, 抛砖引玉:

州退税需要作为收入加回去是因为以前的州税作为SALT是可以用来抵免联邦税的(itemnized), 若当年没有AMT, 那么这部分退税也享受了联邦税的减免, 所以要加回去; 若有AMT, 就被限制了(部分或全部都没享受到联邦税的减免),所以不需要或部分加回去。

这里不懂的是:


3.  If inclusion of the recovery doesn't change your total tax, you don't include the recovery in your income.
      inclusion of the recovery:  把 state refund 重新加回去? 所以去改state withholding 是最好理解的, 就像例子She reduces her 2017 itemized deductions by $1,000 and refigures that year's tax on taxable income of $6,260. 【5260 + 1000】
    所以贴主 加了3000 回去, 发现 还是 85,710

我认为不应该把2017州税withhold 增加来算credit (请注意上面用的是reduce deduction, 州税withhold 是一种deduction), 相反却应该是减少, 一直到新的2017 AMT变成0。

另外, 不一定是只限于exercise ISO 和自己有business 折旧的人。 只要满足2017 有AMT, 而且州税有退税的都要试试。

欢迎讨论!
biostat_04 发表于 4/14/2019 4:17:31 PM
“州退税需要作为收入加回去”是因为standard deduction人人有份,但是你用SALT变成多了itemlized deduction,相比较standard deduction的人多享受了税收优惠。 然后州又refund给你了,那就相当于享受了两次税收优惠。所以IRS才规定这个state and local refund下一年要作为收入加回去。

至于是不是要全额加回去,有个worksheet的,名字叫做State and Local Income Tax Refund Worksheet - Line 10.

---发自Huaren 官方 iOS APP

TOP
agree
0
disagree
0
104#

我前两个星期仔细研究了下, 以为懂了。 结果看完这个又不懂了。

大家讨论下, 抛砖引玉:

州退税需要作为收入加回去是因为以前的州税作为SALT是可以用来抵免联邦税的(itemnized), 若当年没有AMT, 那么这部分退税也享受了联邦税的减免, 所以要加回去; 若有AMT, 就被限制了(部分或全部都没享受到联邦税的减免),所以不需要或部分加回去。

这里不懂的是:


3.  If inclusion of the recovery doesn't change your total tax, you don't include the recovery in your income.
      inclusion of the recovery:  把 state refund 重新加回去? 所以去改state withholding 是最好理解的, 就像例子She reduces her 2017 itemized deductions by $1,000 and refigures that year's tax on taxable income of $6,260. 【5260 + 1000】
    所以贴主 加了3000 回去, 发现 还是 85,710

我认为不应该把2017州税withhold 增加来算credit (请注意上面用的是reduce deduction, 州税withhold 是一种deduction), 相反却应该是减少, 一直到新的2017 AMT变成0。

另外, 不一定是只限于exercise ISO 和自己有business 折旧的人。 只要满足2017 有AMT, 而且州税有退税的都要试试。

欢迎讨论!
biostat_04 发表于 4/14/2019 4:17:31 PM
我觉得大家不是很明白清楚的确定自己符合这个Credit的情况,还是不要轻易的改税表。要是搞错了,追诉期6年,到时候连本带利的要还回去,还增加了以后被audit的几率,为了几百块得不偿失。 建议还是咨询税务专业人士再做定夺。

---发自Huaren 官方 iOS APP

TOP
agree
0
disagree
0
105#





imniz 发表于 4/14/2019 4:16:40 PM 提醒一下大部分人都可能省税的今年才有的特殊情况-105楼

turbotax 貌似没有强调一定要是exercise iso啊。

kunpuring 发表于 4/14/2019 4:35:47 PM
turbo只是一个软件而已,做判断的是人啊。这就是CPA的价值所在。

---发自Huaren 官方 iOS APP

TOP
agree
0
disagree
0
106#

我前两个星期仔细研究了下, 以为懂了。 结果看完这个又不懂了。

大家讨论下, 抛砖引玉:

州退税需要作为收入加回去是因为以前的州税作为SALT是可以用来抵免联邦税的(itemnized), 若当年没有AMT, 那么这部分退税也享受了联邦税的减免, 所以要加回去; 若有AMT, 就被限制了(部分或全部都没享受到联邦税的减免),所以不需要或部分加回去。

这里不懂的是:


3.  If inclusion of the recovery doesn't change your total tax, you don't include the recovery in your income.
      inclusion of the recovery:  把 state refund 重新加回去? 所以去改state withholding 是最好理解的, 就像例子She reduces her 2017 itemized deductions by $1,000 and refigures that year's tax on taxable income of $6,260. 【5260 + 1000】
    所以贴主 加了3000 回去, 发现 还是 85,710

我认为不应该把2017州税withhold 增加来算credit (请注意上面用的是reduce deduction, 州税withhold 是一种deduction), 相反却应该是减少, 一直到新的2017 AMT变成0。

另外, 不一定是只限于exercise ISO 和自己有business 折旧的人。 只要满足2017 有AMT, 而且州税有退税的都要试试。

欢迎讨论!
biostat_04 发表于 4/14/2019 4:17:31 PM




103楼cheesecakefun的帖子
“州退税需要作为收入加回去”是因为standard deduction人人有份,但是你用SALT变成多了itemlized deduction,相比较standard deduction的人多享受了税收优惠。 然后州又refund给你了,那就相当于享受了两次税收优惠。所以IRS才规定这个state and local refund下一年要作为收入加回去。

至于是不是要全额加回去,有个worksheet的,名字叫做State and Local Income Tax Refund Worksheet - Line 10.



回复 提醒一下大部分人都可能省税的今年才有的特殊情况-106楼103楼cheesecakefun的帖子[/url]


if you use the standard deduction, state tax refund does not need to add back.

You might need to add it back when used itemized deductions (depends on if you have AMT or not).

"You might have to report the state income tax refund you received last year on your federal income tax return if you itemized your deductions on your federal return last year and you claimed a deduction for state and local income taxes. You must figure out the taxable portion of your state refund so you can report it. "
最后编辑biostat_04 最后编辑于 2019-04-14 17:25:40
TOP
agree
0
disagree
0
107#

回复106楼biostat_04的帖子
Exactly

---发自Huaren 官方 iOS APP

TOP
agree
0
disagree
0
108#

我前两个星期仔细研究了下, 以为懂了。 结果看完这个又不懂了。

大家讨论下, 抛砖引玉:

州退税需要作为收入加回去是因为以前的州税作为SALT是可以用来抵免联邦税的(itemnized), 若当年没有AMT, 那么这部分退税也享受了联邦税的减免, 所以要加回去; 若有AMT, 就被限制了(部分或全部都没享受到联邦税的减免),所以不需要或部分加回去。

这里不懂的是:


3.  If inclusion of the recovery doesn't change your total tax, you don't include the recovery in your income.
      inclusion of the recovery:  把 state refund 重新加回去? 所以去改state withholding 是最好理解的, 就像例子She reduces her 2017 itemized deductions by $1,000 and refigures that year's tax on taxable income of $6,260. 【5260 + 1000】
    所以贴主 加了3000 回去, 发现 还是 85,710

我认为不应该把2017州税withhold 增加来算credit (请注意上面用的是reduce deduction, 州税withhold 是一种deduction), 相反却应该是减少, 一直到新的2017 AMT变成0。

另外, 不一定是只限于exercise ISO 和自己有business 折旧的人。 只要满足2017 有AMT, 而且州税有退税的都要试试。

欢迎讨论!
biostat_04 发表于 4/14/2019 4:17:31 PM 提醒一下大部分人都可能省税的今年才有的特殊情况-108楼

  太好了, 终于make sense,  确实是 reduce deduction, 就像 IRS525 例子中 【5260 + 1000】, state·refund 应该减去,收入增加才叫 recovery.
多谢多谢! 我把原帖改了,一直奇怪为什么人教的是line 44 增加
TOP
agree
0
disagree
0
109#

去年hit atm, 今年有州税退税。

用楼主的捷径不求甚解大法
把2017 州税退税从W2 WITHHOLD中全减去, 2017 line 47 也没变。

但是用State and Local Income Tax Refund Worksheet - Line 10, 还是需要把州税退税全加回去。

哪个是正解?糊涂了
最后编辑ucjade 最后编辑于 2019-04-14 18:14:38
TOP
agree
0
disagree
0
110#

回复 提醒一下大部分人都可能省税的今年才有的特殊情况-110楼71楼cheesecakefun的帖子[/url]

看不下去了. 华人水大,但平均水平的确不行. 这种错误回帖都一堆人点赞.下面还有回帖附和的,不懂装懂,然后更多人回帖继续错.

你这回帖说的是AMT credit, 在credit类里面. 楼主说的是taxable income, 在income里面. 都不是一个东西.楼主说的部分是因为一般情况下前一年(2017) deduction报多了没税,所以今年(2018)要补税. 但如果2017 itemize并hit AMT, 实际deduction没用上,是税过的, 2018不要再税一遍. 跟ISO有个鸟关系.

mitbbs都理清好几轮了,这里还一知半解.
最后编辑keynorth01 最后编辑于 2019-04-14 18:33:03
TOP
agree
0
disagree
0
发新话题 回复该主题